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Need to Know: Can the Redskins’ Cousins become a top-5 quarterback?

Mar 27, 2016, 5:57 AM EDT


Here is what you need to know on this Sunday, March 27, 32 days before the NFL Draft.


—The Redskins last played a game 77 days ago. It will be about 168 days until they play another one.

Days until: Redskins offseason workouts start 22; 2016 NFL draft 32; Redskins training camp starts 123

Hot topic

On Wednesday at the NFL owners meetings Jay Gruden talked about the pressure that Kirk Cousins is under now that he’s the starting quarterback playing under the franchise tag. “Now all of a sudden when as you’re trying to establish yourself as one of the top five guys in the NFL, now you have a little bit more pressure on yourself to perform and he knows that,” said Gruden.

The “top 5” part drew some attention. That seems to be a rather ambitious goal for a player who was a fourth-round pick and who a year ago was supposed to play out the final year of his rookie contract and then enter an uncertain future as an NFL journeyman. But things change quickly. With Cousins now getting paid nearly $20 million this year under the franchise tag expectations, as outlined by Gruden, have grown exponentially.

Can Cousins be a top five quarterback? He was fifth in passer rating last year and sixth in DVOA but such designations go beyond one-season numbers. When you talk about getting it done year after year and experiencing success in the playoffs, the top guys are Brady, Brees, and Rodgers followed by Wilson, Roethlisberger, and Eli Manning. Then there are others, such as Rivers, Newton, Palmer, and Ryan, who have put up a multiple very good statistical seasons but have had limited playoff success.

So that fills out the top 10 and we haven’t even talked about some other pretty good ones like Dalton and Flacco and other young payers who will be trying to move into the top five like Winston, Carr, and Mariota.

Right now, when you’re talking about career achievement, you have to put Cousins somewhere between 10 and 15, maybe a touch lower depending on how you want to rank quarterbacks like Cutler and Alex Smith. He has a very tall mountain to climb to even move into the top 10. Unless Scot McCloughan can get a Super Bowl caliber roster together and keep the group together for a few years, the top five may be an unreachable star for Cousins.

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140 Comments (Feed for Comments)
  1. hail74 - Mar 27, 2016 at 8:33 AM

    Of the QBs mentioned, only Brady,Brees,Rodgers and Ben can carry a team. All the others are only as good as the team around them so yeah, cousins could be top 5 if he gets the same type of support as those guys.

    • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:33 AM

      I think Cam then Carr are the next elite QBs of the NFL. Cousins elevating to a top 5 QB is possible but I still have serious concerns with is overall arm strength. I think Cousins’ average arm strength will be tough push him into such an elite status. Joe Montana did it without a strong NFL arm so it’s not impossible. I think you left out one player (Phillip Rivers) that has also carried his team for years. Regardless of his playoff success, Rivers has always been a top 10 QB even in his worst season.

      • dba - Mar 27, 2016 at 1:55 PM

        He has an above average arm. He’s thrown deep on occasion and does so only when he sees a good play can come out of it. Rivers didn’t carry his team the last two seasons. He’s not that great.

      • John - Mar 27, 2016 at 3:55 PM

        Montana also had great teams around him. The 49ers defense did a number on Marino after he threw 48 TD passes and 5,084 yards in 1984. Montana also had a HOF coach.

      • the lumberjack - Mar 28, 2016 at 8:01 AM

        Cousins threw the ball 59 mph at scouting combine. tied for 2nd all time. arm strength not a problem.

      • sidepull - Mar 28, 2016 at 9:27 AM

        I was actually glad Rivers didn’t go to the Giants. He is such a competitor and he would have had a SB by now, maybe more than Eli.

    • wildbill1952 - Mar 27, 2016 at 1:18 PM

      I know it’s a popular notion that a single player can “carry a team”, but the notion is filled with holes. Rodgers can’t carry the team with all of his best receivers sidelined and no running game. Brady can’t carry a team without an offensive line and a defense to stop the other team from scoring. etc.etc. When you look at the history of the sport, there are multiple examples of a HOF QB that was nothing on a poor team (Steve Young at Tampa Bay vs. Steve Young on the 49ers) or the opposite Matt Cassell 11-5 with the Pats and Matt Cassel anywhere else).

      QB is the most important position, without a doubt. But Brady or Manning or Cam or Big Ben at Cleveland would have looked very ordinary,

    • malcolm - Mar 27, 2016 at 7:18 PM

      If you think Kirk Cousins is as good as Cam Newton or Russell Wilson you are insane

      • John - Mar 28, 2016 at 8:58 PM

        Both of those guys have much better teams, especially defenses around them, but then what does that matter.

    • Dabon'em - Mar 29, 2016 at 2:14 PM

      Well, I think Redskins fans will be in for a rude awakening next season. Tony Romo will be back, The Giants and Eagles will be better as well (Victor Cruz, new coach). At the end of the day Kirk Cousins is mediocre. The stats only give a portion of the play. A lot of short balls thrown (high completion percentage?). They’ll lose to good teams and may win against bad to mediocre teams. Next season will be when we see the real difference between Rg3 and Kirk. Is he top 15?, maybe but he’s getting paid like a top 5 guy. So fans and the media better hold him to a high standard of expectation like they did to Robert .

  2. skinsforever38 - Mar 27, 2016 at 8:54 AM

    Dude plz let me have what you’re drinking. It’s called the “eye test”. Cousins had a really good season, but top 5 come on, even Rich had to stop and think about that one. A supporting cast helps every QB, especially Big Ben. The Steelers D was amazing every yr Ben won, and so was Brady’s teams. Cousins might get there but it will take a helluva lot.

    • John - Mar 27, 2016 at 3:18 PM

      Notice the point, the Sttelers had great defenses and so did the Patriots. The Packers, when they won it all had a great defense but Rogers also had Nelson, Driver, Jones, a whole crew of really good receivers and they relied in the run more in the playoffs.

      Keep in mind that Bradshaw win 4 Super Bowls with a team loaded with Hall of Famers, especially on defense (Mean Joe Green, LC Greenwood, Lambert and Ham and Mel Blount). Joe Gibbs went to 4 Super Bowls with 3 different QBs and won 3.

      It takes a lot more than a QB. The Ravens won with Dilfer. Hell, the Dolphins got to the Super Bowl with David Woodley and the Falcons got there with?

      • lezziemcdykerson - Mar 28, 2016 at 5:13 PM

        The point is that he’s getting paid like a top 5 QB (right now) so he needs to play like one. Can he? Are we a top 5 team in any of the major statistical categories? We’ve got some young guys with some seemingly high ceilings. I sure hope Kirk can play to his but I just can’t offer an opinion. As of right now he’s Rex Grossman year one with the Bears. Bunch of will he/won’t he’s. Hopefully he won’t regress. An entire offseason with 1st team reps, look to see him start strong by week 6 I’ll tell you guys what he’s going to be lol.

    • Chad - Mar 27, 2016 at 3:39 PM

      Dude, he was rates 5th last season, and by anyone’s math…5th….um…is top 5.
      Maybe he should of said maintain a top 5 qb position.

    • Skulb - Mar 27, 2016 at 4:18 PM

      But he was top 5 last season, statistically. You’re acting like Rich postulated that Cousins was secretly an alien spy, come to prepare the invasion of the Mothership. All he’s asking is if Cousins can stay on that form or if he will dip in his second year. Reasonable question I think.

  3. Mr.moneylover - Mar 27, 2016 at 9:29 AM

    I think he can if he don’t let his success go to his head and stay grounded and focus…I think kirk cousins can turn into a cocky NFL QB that nobody likes but it all depends on his work ethic and that’s why jay gruden probably feel confident that he gonna take that next step…every time something mention kirk he giggles and smile

  4. sidepull - Mar 27, 2016 at 9:37 AM

    If that were to happen, Kirk a franchise, lights out QB, a lot of peoples jobs are going to pay well in the Redskins organization. The only one not getting the money will be Shanahan. Maybe then, just maybe, the fans can unite behind one QB.

  5. waqgman1 - Mar 27, 2016 at 9:40 AM

    Wow. Not even the end of March and the negativity drums are beating already. Maybe you should move to Cleveland and cover the Browns where your favorite former Redskin quarterback now plays.

    • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:40 AM

      Why are there so many tools like this who have poor reading comprehension? The article was fairly well round which is maybe something you can’t handle or understand. This was in no way negative but instead provided constructive criticism while taking into account the competition around him.

      It’s you that needs to move to another city and root for another team since we have enough feeble minded fans in Washington.

  6. renhoekk2 - Mar 27, 2016 at 9:51 AM

    Not sure what criteria is used for everyone’s rankings. Statistically speaking Romo has been a top 5 QB at times. Nobody expected that from an UDFA after his first season starting. If we are talking playoff wins that is much more a team result than an individual player one. Does Wilson get to the Superbowl without that defense and Beast Mode? Does Cam get to the Super Bowl without both a top 5 defense and running game? Even the year Rodgers and GB won the Super Bowl they had a top 5 defense. Dan Marino had little playoff success but no one would question he was a top 5 QB in the NFL in his prime. You can have a top 5 QB but if your running game and defense are going to be ranked in the 20’s don’t expect a long playoff run.

    • Cesar - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:35 AM

      Rogers never had a top 5 defense ever

      • renhoekk2 - Mar 28, 2016 at 10:46 AM


        Stats say otherwise.

        NFL Team Total Defense Statistics – 2010

        Statistics: Total | Downs | Passing | Rushing | Receiving | Returning | Kicking | Punting | Defense | Give/Take
        Offense | Defense
        Net Total Yards Leaders
        1 San Diego 4345 271.6 2845 177.8 1500 93.8 322 20.1
        2 Pittsburgh 4429 276.8 3425 214.1 1004 62.8 232 14.5
        3 NY Jets 4664 291.5 3210 200.6 1454 90.9 304 19.0
        4 New Orleans 4900 306.3 3103 193.9 1797 112.3 307 19.2
        5 Green Bay 4945 309.1 3107 194.2 1838 114.9 240 15.0

    • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:52 AM

      long term success in scoring and yard production culminated by many wins against all defenses defines the best quarterbacks. Marino may not have won a SB but he had many wins and many great seasons. The manner in which he sliced up the 85 bears defense is one of the greatest games I’ve ever seen by a QB.

    • Trey Gregory - Mar 28, 2016 at 4:35 AM

      Thank you for saying it. I was about to say, “I know this is a Redskins blog; but not a single mention of Romo as a top 10 QB? Really?” But at least someone mentioned him.

      Some of these conversations are a little ridiculous. Too many to comment on all of them. Give credit where it’s due guys. Just about every QB I’ve seen brought up is very good. Differentiating between them gets sticky, but can be done. It just gets silly when we’re postulating about if a QB could or couldn’t carry a team or win with other pieces. We don’t know. All we have to go on is what’s actually happened in reality.

  7. 226thebeatdontstop - Mar 27, 2016 at 10:02 AM

    Questions should be can Cousins the new face of the franchise and 20 million dollar quarterback lead the team to consecutive NFC East titles, can he beat teams over .500 and can he win a playoff game

    • goback2rfk - Mar 27, 2016 at 10:14 AM


    • John - Mar 27, 2016 at 10:45 AM

      Not last year, the way the team was up and down like a yo-yo. It takes all 53. The defense and running game were just as responsible as the QB. The QB can get the team up and down the field but you need the ground game to eat up click. The defense still has to stop the other team. There are going to be games against tough opponents and they, not just Kirk will have to perform. Did Manning carry the Broncos last year? No! He had a kick ass defense to back him up. Our undermanned defense fell apart against Green Bay.

      • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:59 AM

        John, it’s true the defense broke down but so did Cousins performance. You can’t continue to justify Cousins performance in big games by looking towards failure in other positions. Cousins came out sharp against the Packers but failed to maintain his performance the whole game. That’s just a fact that has nothing to do with the defense. However, the lack of running game does have a direct impact on the QB’s performance. But I stress it was the direction the coaches choose to go with that offensive scheme in 2015. They replaced much of the running game with the short passing game. So if that’s is what the coaches choose to do then it’s the burden the QB must accept. In the end it falls on the QB to win with the scheme giving to him. Cousins accomplished a lot in 2015 but he also left a lot of questions still left unanswered. That’s just where it ended up IMO.

        • hail74 - Mar 27, 2016 at 6:54 PM

          It’s my opinion that they switched to short passes in lue of the run because they had to. Go back and watch the games. After the Atlanta game, the line couldn’t open up lanes and the backs could do nothing on their own.

      • mozart6023 - Mar 28, 2016 at 6:46 PM

        Kirk also fell apart against Green Bay. He looked scared like a deer in headlights.

    • John - Mar 27, 2016 at 3:27 PM

      He will. Remember he has only had one season of consistent playing time and it takes 2 to 3 seasons for a young QB to really get it. This co.king seask. They will work with Kirk to Taylor the offense to him, so he runs the things lines and is good at. As the team vets more talent, the more they’ll accomplish.

  8. goback2rfk - Mar 27, 2016 at 10:14 AM


    • goback2rfk - Mar 27, 2016 at 10:43 AM

      Top 10?!?! HAHAHAHAHAHA

    • Your an idiot - Mar 27, 2016 at 3:48 PM

      Was rated 5th last season…hahahahaha haha ah
      Now your even more stupider….hahahahahahah

      • - Mar 28, 2016 at 4:40 AM

        More stupider? Really?

        Geez. And your name is “your an idiot.” It’s you’re bro. You’re.

        I agree with your take on Cousins though. So there’s that.

        And Skulb is dead right for the rest of this. All personal feelings aside, he played at a very high level last year. If we assume people are coming at this issue biased, thus seeing what they want, then we can turn to stats. His stats in the second half of the season were actually elite. Also, his stats in the first half weren’t half bad. He was still in the upper half of the NFL.

    • gasngo14 - Mar 27, 2016 at 6:06 PM

      robert who?

    • Skulb - Mar 27, 2016 at 9:56 PM

      Laughing at this just shows how little you’re paying attention. In 2015 KC was 7th in completions, 1st in %, 10th in YPA and 12th in QBR. Statistically he was top 10 last year in the regular season but had a remarkable upswing in form. From week 8 out he may well have been #1. Obviously it might not be realistic to expect him to keep up this level of play. But top 5 would actually mean a step down from last year’s stretch form.
      And still people who decided long before he ever played that they don’t like him are laughing. Well keep laughing. The longer you do it the dumber you’ll look in the end.

      • goback2rfk - Mar 28, 2016 at 12:22 AM

        Just because Cousins puts up some good numbers at the end of the season last year does not mean he is a top 10 QB

        • Skulb - Mar 28, 2016 at 2:23 AM

          Obviously not. But it means that statistically he was a top ten QB last season. If you have some elaborate ranking in your head based on whatever then fine. It still doesn’t change the stats.
          If he keeps going like he was going from week 8 to 16 then he will be a top 5 QB in 2016.
          And that is being conservative because statistically he was in the top 2 in that period. The only one who got close or you could say was better if you wanted was Russell Wilson.

  9. COSkinsfan - Mar 27, 2016 at 10:17 AM

    If we can get more deep throwd back in our offense that would help a lot. Before we had Djax Garcon was the guy. Im not sure if he’s losy a step but it seems like we never use him that way anymore. The marks of a great quarterback are performing under pressure and elevating the play of his wr’s. Brady is the perfect example of this, other than Moss who has been a star wr for him? He has done it with mostly cast offs. Rodgers and Brees have also done a lot without a star wr. Cousins has good recievers. If he can take the step ofelevating their play the O will be scary.

  10. Bo - Mar 27, 2016 at 10:29 AM

    Omg stop with this junk already. He’s played one full season we were an embarrassment in alot of games. He no where near a top 5 qb yet. Ask this question at the end of this season and hopefully he will be a winning team. Top 5 come on bruh no drinking on the job.

    • Rich Tandler - Mar 27, 2016 at 2:05 PM

      Just quoting his head coach, bruh.

      • Bo - Mar 27, 2016 at 2:10 PM

        Your the best!!

  11. Seth Thompson - Mar 27, 2016 at 10:34 AM

    For some reason u list Wilson in 4th place. More like tied for 1st. Skins paying for and acting like Kirk top 5….rude awakening coming . Hopefully GM smarter than his quotes.

    • Rich Tandler - Mar 27, 2016 at 2:05 PM

      I didn’t list Wilson first, that wasn’t the GM talking and nobody is acting like Cousins is a top 5 QB. Other than all that, spot on comment!

    • Trey Gregory - Mar 28, 2016 at 4:44 AM

      You really think Wilson is the best QB in the NFL? Over Brady and Rogers? I’ll even throw Brees in there. Wilson is very good. But possibly the best QB to ever play is still in the league and maybe playing his best right now. That just seems a little hyperbolic to me.

      • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 28, 2016 at 9:26 PM

        Call me crazy but I think Brees had a better season than any other QB in 2015. It was amazing what he did playing under a really bad Saints team.

  12. Travis - Mar 27, 2016 at 10:36 AM

    No he can’t! And that’s not an insult to Cousins. He’s a decent, maybe really good, Qb. But it was 1 season he showed good promise, but he’s also had his share of bad moments. I will say he proved a lot of people wrong, and he deserves an apology for that, so I’m sorry. Myself and a lot of others didn’t even think he could be a starter. But you earn top 5 by years of getting it done, not by one season where stats are decent.

  13. therealistcat - Mar 27, 2016 at 10:55 AM

    Not even a top 15 QB. As I have pointed out before, (and this was analytically proven) most of his stats came from having one of the lowest yards per reception percentages in the league, and one of the highest screen pass percentages in the league. Gruden moved away from the run and did all he could to pad Cousins stats to accomplish getting Robert off the team and moving forward with his love affair with Kirk. However, smart teams ala, Carolina, Green Bay, game one Dallas, game one Eagles, NY Jets, etc..) watched film on Kirk and ran man, even zero coverage at times, which proved to cripple Cousin game. Ultimately, the mishandling of RG III, will prove to be one of the costliest moves, not only in Redskins history, but also in the history of the NFL. Hue Jackson, Tom House, and the Browns organization is already proving that a talent like Robert can be properly cultivated. You will see Redskins fans! Watch and see!

    • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 27, 2016 at 12:32 PM

      I can be critic of Cousins but I also acknowledge his achievements. Cousins did make some significant improvements as a starting QB. His pre-snap reads and setup of the offense was impressive. He maintained a very low sack rate by getting rid of the ball quickly. Yes I agree there were an abundance of short passes (68% average of less than 10 yards). However, he achieved that by keeping his interceptions low while improving on his touchdown numbers. His 3rd down success rate was also very good for most the season. Heck, he even did a fairly nice job of running read option. Overall, there was a lot of success by Cousins and he deserves credit. He improved enough to show he can produce huge comebacks and game winning drives. He’s shown enough to give some confidence he can be continue to improve to where he is capable of beating the better defenses in the league.

      I think there are still serious questions about how good Cousins can be but overall he was better than the average NFL QB in 2015. He proved he could improve from 2014 so who is to say he can’t continue to improve?

      There also seems to be some conspiracy theories thrown in here. Gruden moved away from the run to pad Cousins numbers in hopes of keeping RG3 off the field? Well, you must consider Gruden to be quite the mastermind. To take what you deem a below average QB under such a plan and then achieve all this is actually quite an accomplishment. Heck, if he just focused on just winning games you have to wonder what Gruden can actually do for this team?

      I also agree RG3 was shafted by Gruden and this organization throughout his career. I still think RG3 can be an elite QB where, outside of Buffalo, playing under Hue may be the best thing for him. I’m actually excited for Cleveland and RG3 next season. If RG3 excels and Cleveland improves under him while this team struggles well we can both claim we saw this coming. However, I prefer to consider the facts that came out of the 2015 season that has given me some hope that Cousins can become an accomplished QB. He’s a great young man and I’d be happy to have him as our QB for years to come if his performance allows it.

    • ifthethunderdontgetya™³²®© - Mar 27, 2016 at 4:10 PM

      Gruden moved away from the run and did all he could to pad Cousins stats to accomplish getting Robert off the team

      Cool story.

      • bangkokben - Mar 27, 2016 at 4:19 PM

        This cat is like the guy at the black jack table that always double downs on fives.

        • therealistcat - Mar 27, 2016 at 6:59 PM

          your analogy must apply to all who post on here, correct? Or is it just for people who you disagree with? If I were actually a betting man I wouldn’t mind playing poker against someone like you. Your tactics would certainly lend to a limited arsenal, easily picked apart.

        • Trey Gregory - Mar 28, 2016 at 4:47 AM

          More like doubling down on a 17. At least you’re not going to bust on a 5. There’s no redeeming quality to anything he’s saying

      • therealistcat - Mar 27, 2016 at 7:34 PM

        Why else would you do the following:

        -Slam Robert in the media before the Tampa and San Fran game in 2014.
        -Fail to run a two minute drill (one of Robert’s strengths) during the same (San Fran) game when you were only down by 3 points before the half.
        -Say he’s making great progress with running the scheme throughout the offseason program (which I witnessed myself at some of the practices)? Yet you were lying the whole time about your intentions to start him.
        -put him behind a makeshift line in a preseason game that doesn’t count; behind a left tackle that you knew would not make the team the day he started against Detroit—-dude was at least 3rd or 4th on the depth chart.
        -Keep him in the same game despite the pounding your starting qb was taking? This was my first clue that there was no genuine intent to start him for the regular season.
        -Fail to call plays that got Griffin into a rhythm the same way you did Kirk.
        -Leverage a shaky concussion situation to sit him on the bench from 1st to 3rd literally in one day.

        That Friday Robert runs with the one’s at Andrews Air Force base for the morning walkthrough, by that evening despite the fact that Griffin ran full gear all week (against the standard concussion protocol process, which I studies immensely), and was a full go all that week, you all demoted him to 3rd string by that evening. And for good measure the Doctor that changed the prognosis in the 11th hour resigns from his position shortly thereafter.

        You call it a story? I call it spade of spade (for my new friend bangkokben). This hot mess of a coach and team conducted themselves like total unprofessionals and they got away with it. Whats worse is that thousand of you fans (many of you are awesome people) will continue to support this dreadful organization in the name of fandom. I loved this team for decades; virtually my whole life. This situation———how this young man was treated, was so surreal to me, that I have withdrawn my support for this team indefinitely.

        • howie70 - Mar 27, 2016 at 9:53 PM

          I can’t figure out why all the Robert cult followers that say they are no longer Redskin fans are still on here posting.

        • John - Mar 28, 2016 at 12:31 AM


          Please go to Cleveland and get a room with your idol RGme. There was an in house QB competition. They did not mention it to the press, so as to minimize the drama. I guess they forgot to ask your permission? Kirk won the job, despite the conspiracies. This is further backed up by RGmes not so spectacular play in 2013 and 2014 and 2015 preseason. Kirk won the job and kept the job. When other teams needed QBa during the season, did they call the Skins to try to get RGme? No! Did 10-15 teams call Robert in for interviews? No! Who signed RGme? The Broncos, the Jets, the 49ers, the Chiefs, the Bills? Nope! Cleveland did, the worst team in the NFL, the QB graveyard. Your idol is done!

        • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 28, 2016 at 6:50 PM

          You only demean yourself as a knowledgeable fan every time you use that RG3 “Me” reference. It’s obvious there is more hate and contempt towards the person than any understanding of RG3 as a NFL QB.

        • Skulb - Mar 28, 2016 at 11:42 PM

          The problem is really that what you keep posting here as if it was established fact is not something the rest of us agree with. Partly you have a peculiar interpretation of events and partly you’re just making stuff up, or repeating things other people made up.

          1: He slammed Robert in the media after the Tampa game, and really after Robert threw the team under the bus in the post game presser. Maybe this was a mistake by Gruden but this was certainly not productive behavior from Robert to start with. A lot of fans turned against Robert because of that presser and were happy that the coach took him down a peg for it. I’m betting quite a few of his teammates felt the same. Gruden needed to do this to avoid losing the locker room, which he would have done if he had placed an unproductive player above the team.

          2: A two minute drill is not likely have saved Bob against the 9ers because he wasn’t looking for receivers by this point, but at his feet or toward the sidelines.

          3: Making progress does not mean better than Cousins, which he wasn’t in any of the preseasons they were together on the team.

          4: The “makeshift line” was not the problem. Robert’s protection was. When it comes to the replacement left tackle you keep blaming for that, and who indeed was wrongly blamed for it, Willie Smith, he was in fact not to blame. Robert was the one who slid his protection to the right, leaving Willie double teamed at left tackle. He then dallied with the ball, as is his habit, while the guy he had released from protection rushed past Smith, who decided to block the DT on his right side. it might also have been Alf’s fault for not blocking the free rusher. But it was not Willie Smith’s fault. It certainly wasn’t Gruden’s fault. Hell it wasn’t even Dan Snyder’s fault.

          5: He was kept in the game because he was supposed to be the starting QB, and therefore the one being paid to adjust to defensive fronts and schemes during professional NFL games. The reason there was no intent to start him, which was obvious in 2014 already, was that he was no good, at least not in a WC offense.

          6: No plays got Griffin in rhythm. Every time he needed to do something to keep in rhythm he would do something else instead, and usually something that made his line lose track of where he was so he got sacked.

          7: The noncussion was a face saving ploy on Griffin;’s behalf, not some evil pl;an from Gruden. Rather than benching him and letting the whole world know that he was a bad QB he was simply “concussed” and allowed to disappear on the bench. This was a good thing for Robert, and quite possibly why anyone at all was interested in him now.

          Disagreeing is fine. But stop pretending that we agree on the facts here because we really don’t. Your agenda seems to be to blame Gruden for everything and Bob for nothing. My agenda is for the Redskins to do well, not to engage in this mindless sports soap opera. Gruden is a professional. His job depends on winning games and that is, I am fairly sure, his only agenda. If that means ruffling some feathers then so be it. Real Skins fans have long since moved on. Winning the East made that very easy, so I am having a hard time understanding why you keep harping on this baloney. None of what happened to Griffin would have happened if he had been a serviceable NFL QB. That’s just the end of it.

    • John - Mar 27, 2016 at 5:54 PM

      RG3, the player that all his followers thought had multiple teams salivating and falling all over themselves to sign him, ended up with one offer, from the worst team in the league. Gruden was not responsible for RGmes fall. It was all on RGme. His fall will continue, especially now that he is in football hell.

      • howie70 - Mar 27, 2016 at 9:55 PM

        There you go letting facts get in the way of a good delusional conspiracy theory by Robert’s cult.

      • greed - Mar 28, 2016 at 10:33 AM

        1. Its all spilt milk now!2.there was no qb competition if there was Cousins wouldve started the second game and rg wouldve came in against the backups also rg wouldve played and attempted more passes in game one, clearly gruden was looking for a reason to pull him especially after the jets called after first prereason game inquiring about trading for cousins after geno got his jaw broken, as reported scott was ready to ship him out bv gruden balk at the move cause that who he wanted to start all along remember he said in off season their was going to be open competition then couple days later he says griffin the starter and then praised his progress all thru minicamp ota training camp.3 RG3 Pick browns because He believes Hue really wants him supports him and believes in him , why go to a team no matter what the record is and put yourself with a hc who not tyin himself with you see gruden.4 see point 1 it all spilt milk now doesnt matter until…. We play the browns

        • Rich Tandler - Mar 28, 2016 at 10:57 AM

          This is funny. It’s spilled milk but yet you spend a couple of hundred words complaining about the whole process again.

          If you want to talk about it, talk about it. But just be honest that you are rehashing without all of your facts being straight.

        • greed - Mar 28, 2016 at 2:27 PM

          yeah RICH it is spilt milk and im not complaining no need to whats done is done im simply joining in the convo that led to this point which facts arent true? Im only restating what ive read on other blogs , reporters , newspaper websites infact i read in the nypost the jets have been intrest in cousins a couple of times now how far talks and things go yeah i dont know so please im not the one complaining i wish rg the best but i wish kirk the most! He the qb of my team now the team i love since 81 when i first started watcing nfl , my angst is with gruden putting pressure on kirk with that top 5 comment when theres already enough pressure just trying to establish himself as a winning QB

        • John - Mar 28, 2016 at 5:24 PM

          Another RG3 worshipper. Pretty soon you’ll be seeing him back in Washington playing at Verizon Center for the Arena Football Team…LOL!

      • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 28, 2016 at 6:53 PM

        How do you know how many offers RG3 had? He made a wise choice in playing under Hue where he’ll be the starter. He also received a significant more from the contract than lame haters like you John want to admit.

        • John - Mar 28, 2016 at 10:07 PM

          He deserves all he can get. I don’t take issue with him getting $6 million guaranteed and as much as what $15 million over 2 years. I’m not a hater, I’m a realist. Based on what Rob has done since 2012, which is not much to write home about and going to a team known as the QB graveyard, regardless of Jackson and House, I don’t see him succeeding.
          He was very good in college (Heisman) and very good as a rookie, but what has he done since? He won’t be the athlete that made things work in 2012. He is not a pocket passer. He does not have the body of a Newton or Tebow to hold up in that kind of system.

          We know he visited 2 teams and walked away with nothing in NY and signed in Cleveland. Where were all the other teams that were supposed to dieing to sign him? He’s not all that.

        • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 28, 2016 at 10:30 PM

          “He was very good in college (Heisman) and very good as a rookie, but what has he done since? He won’t be the athlete that made things work in 2012. He is not a pocket passer. He does not have the body of a Newton or Tebow to hold up in that kind of system.”

          I can’t believe I have to go down this path with anyone that even has a notion of the history of the team after 2012. You totally ignore the severe injury that normally take two years for a full recovery, how that cost him critical development opportunity, then soon to follow the coaching change that came with the introduction of a rookie coach who not only failed to get production out of one but all three quarterbacks in 2014. Gruden made strides in improving his coaching in 2015 with the help of the addition of many veteran coaches along side of him. however, lets not ignore the complete circus that existed in his first year where just about every aspect of the team was a complete disaster. And you expect RG3 or any young QB to thrive under those conditions?

          I really think you are wrong and misled about RG3’s ability to play in the pocket. He ran a spread offense at Baylor and just because it’s a spread offense and not a pro style offense, there is a still a pocket. In college RG3 beat out Luck in almost every statistic throwing out of the pocket. If you want to critique RG3 issues; it really falls on his pre-snap reads and ability to drop back. RG3 is much more compfortable in a shotgun formation when passing out of a pocket. Yes his development in passing out of the pocket has stalled playing in the NFL. However, there are obvious reasons like injury and coaching turnover you just want to avoid considering as reasons. I do think you have an emotional hatred towards the kid because you love to root for his failure and love to throw hurl epithets about him.

        • John - Mar 28, 2016 at 10:59 PM

          Yeah Gruden was a better coach in 2015 because he had a better staff to help carry the load this past season. He did not have to be HC, OC, QC and babysitter.

          There was no “tweeting” or hashtags or other social media nonsense. Had Robert not feared for his job, he would not have rushed back “all in for game 1” or whatever the title of the rehab video leading into 2013. Funny how defenses changed to play the style of offense the Skins ran in 2012 in 2013 and Rob refused to run it, but somehow it was everyone else’s fault.

          Wonder how well he will do with a high draft pick QB in Cleveland? There will be pressure to play the rookie. If he felt threatened by Kirk, how’s he going to do there with Went or Goff? Its only a matter of time before he fails!

        • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 28, 2016 at 11:25 PM

          “He did not have to be HC, OC, QC and babysitter.”
          By his own stupidity he made that choice in 2014 yet you reserve all your criticism for RG3 instead of the coach.

          It’s only a matter of time before he fails within your hate-filled mind about RG3. You want him to so you set out to declare he will even before a single draft selection has been made. The point is even if either QB is selected; I expect Hue will not rush either onto the field. RG3 will have at least a full season to show his value at Cleveland. That’s all he really needs to reestablish himself as the talent he is capable. That’s about the same time Cousins had with the Skins to do the same. So keep up the ignorance and hate about RG3. That bubble of ignorance you keep inflating just be blow up in your face.

          Seriously, why do you hate RG3 so much? You really are itching for him to fail.

        • Trey Gregory - Mar 29, 2016 at 1:21 PM

          It’s like some fans think they have to chose a side. Like you can only like Cousins or RG3 and that if one is successful it mean you were wrong about your guys. It’s really childish.

          Anyways though. I think the Cleveland situation is awful for RG3. I believe in him, I know he has talent, but I think Cleveland will be the final nail in the coffin. Too little talent, too much frustration with fans, an inpatient owner, just lots of stuff. But I believe that if they take Wentz he will be starting by midseason. Unless RG3 is having an absolutely remarkable season. People will want to see who they have in their first round QB. It’s just a bad situation.

        • John - Mar 29, 2016 at 12:18 PM

          He succeeded at Baylor because he was able to make plays with his legs. He also succeeded because defense is a dirty word in that conference. College and the pros are two totally different games. In the pros, everyone is good and the defenders are all fast, even the slower ones. The spread can make any offense look good until they run into a talented defense (ex: Oregon vs. Ohio State). Sure they get to a lot of bowl games but that’s not difficult when you only have to win 6 games. Granted they won more like 10 or 11 but even stiil there are plenty of college teams that do that.

          Regarding hating Robert, I’m nowhere near the guy who posted on Comcast the other day, “I don’t want to hate him, but I hate him”. It started like that and listed that the guy hated him and his folks and hoped he stepped on a rake which hit him in the face and made him fall down a hundred stares covered in broken glass. I said not post that one.

          I just don’t see him making it in this league. They will have to simplify things for him so he does not have complex reads. He needs to learn route concepts and coverage. He is going to have to run in order to survive and he is going to have to stop being a pinball and get down or suffer injuries as his body is not built forvfhe NFL beating.

          For the money he and a high draft rookie QB will get, one or the other will play. Management is not going to be happy paying out all that money and be happy when Austin Davis trots onto the field.

          I just don’t see how he is supposed to be all that. Just another Heisman bust.

    • Trey Gregory - Mar 28, 2016 at 4:50 AM

      Ok. I shouldn’t encourage you but I want to know how the Browns are ALREADY proving they can cultivate RG3’s talent. I’m almost positive they’re not even allowed to talk football yet per the collective bargaining agreement. It’s also not even time for OTAs. If they’re doing that then they’re the greatest staff ever assembled in NFL history.

    • Bo - Mar 28, 2016 at 2:05 PM

      You are 100% correct glad to see other fans with common sense.

  14. Youngin - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:07 AM

    Not even a top 10 but with that money you gotta show me that it is not just being handed the job but you do something with it like not only a playoff birth but actually win. And I mean against winning teams. Will be interesting because Romo is back and Giants have loaded up on defense.

  15. Earl Carver - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:13 AM

    I will take a top 5 defense anyday… Trent Dilfer and the Ravens are a perfect example of a bottom tier QB and a Top 5 D winning the Super Bowl… Defense wins Championships….

    • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 27, 2016 at 12:36 PM

      Great defenses might give a team a few good years but great Quarterbacks can give a team a generation of success.

      • bangkokben - Mar 27, 2016 at 2:43 PM

        Spot on here. Eleven moving parts gelling at the same time from different ages, experiences, salaries, positions, etc; is not any easier than finding a top 5 QB. And if you do find a QB you have yourself a ten year window as opposed to a three year window.

      • John - Mar 27, 2016 at 2:59 PM

        But not necessarily results. What has Rivers accomplished? What did Marino do with the Dolphins? What has Romo done with Dallas? But, but, but….

        It takes a team, not just a QB. If it was just the QB, those guys would have accomplished far more.

        • Trey Gregory - Mar 28, 2016 at 1:11 PM

          Well Marino made one super bowl, got the Dolphins all kinds of fans from across the country who still root for them because of Marino, and they had A LOT of good seasons.

          I’m sorry, but the notion that a QB only accomplishes somehing if they win a Super Bowl is complete BS. In the NFL. winning season or a playoff berth is accomplishment enough. I watch my team for 16 games before the post season. I want them to win Marie games than they lose. That’s an accomplishment. There’s too many other moving parts, unknowns, and a bit of luck for us to say guys like Marino never accomplished anything.

          The Cowboys have had a lot of good seasons with Romo and are always at least in the race to win the division because of Romo. Rivers has had some god awful teams around him, but he gets those fans a couple more wins than they would have had every year because he’s so good. And he has had some pretty good seasons. He beats division rivals for the fans and makes watching football fun for them because they believe they can win with him under center. That’s not nothing.

          As a Washingtin fan, after years of incompetency, you should appreciate what a winning season or stability under center really is.

        • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 28, 2016 at 6:57 PM

          If you need to ask what Marino accomplished then you don’t know the history of the game. Man you just revealed what little you know with this comment.

        • John - Mar 28, 2016 at 9:43 PM

          A QB does not have to win a Super Bowl to be seen as a success but to many see that as a key measurement. Marino got to one without much of a team around him. Marino was successful with 2 receivers, no running game and not much defense. Romo has been successful and the Cowboys were pathetic without him last year, however, he has bombed out several times. Rivers has had very good teams around him at times but they don’t have much to show for it.

          As far as QBs go, I’ll take Elway over all of them. 5 Super Bowl trips (2 wins). People want to point out Montana as the best but he always had complete teams around him. Elway finally won the Super Bowls in 1998 and 1999 because he finally had complete teams. Montana had Rice and Taylor and Jones and Craig and Ricky Waters and Floyd and they always had an excellent defense . For the vast majority of his career, Elway never had teams like that around him yet performed at a very high level.

        • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 28, 2016 at 10:03 PM

          Rivers has many challenges trying to compete while playing in a small market. The player turnover in San Diego is just brutal.

          Now, Elway certainly is one of the greatest QBs of all time. However, Elway played under some very good teams before he won his first SB. The issue for Elway is he ran into the NFC East every time he had a shot to win it all. The NFC East in that era was just unmatched and collectively probably the greatest division of all time.

          What sustains a team’s success the longest is in no doubt, in my mind, an elite franchise quarterback. Ask any Dolphin Fan not older than 50 and the Glory days belong to when Marino played under center. On the other hand, a great defenses is almost impossible to keep intact longer than 2 to 3 years in today’s game. As many have tried to explain, there are just too many moving parts to hold onto in a league that strives for parity.

      • John - Mar 31, 2016 at 2:25 AM

        Elway had decent teams around him but they were. Ever that good. Terrible running game with Winder and Wilhite and Sewell and a small defense that got pushed around. Worked OK in the AFC but not against the NFC.

        Regarding Rivers, he’s had good teams around him with LT and one of the best TEs in the game. They had more opportunities than most and were not able to pull it off.

        Regarding Marino and Elway, both operated under the same rules. Denver did a better job with drafting, etc. Remember, back then, there was no salary cap. They had just as much an opportunity to draft amend stash players like the Skins used to do.

        Marino was very good and threw alot of TD passes and tons of yards but the teams he played on went to 1Super Bowl and into the playoffs several times but that’s it.
        In this day and age with the cap, if you have one of those guys, you pay him a huge chunk of your cap and it ties the teams hands. New Orleans and Brees are a perfect example. They have so much committed to Brees that the can’t resign people or sign free agents and their defense sucks. When he retires in a few years that team will be a complete wasteland.

        Regarding this team, they’ll get Kirk’s contract squared, probably in July. He seems pretty grounded and able to grow and learn from his mistakes. He had a pretty strong year, especially, the last 11 games. Believe it or not, he carried the team on his back. Just give him time. The defense needs to improve big time. They could still use a dynamic running back and need to get younger at WR. Only then will the Skins be a perennial contender.

        The good thing is they have a leg up with Kirk being 25 and Romo and Eli being 35, with their best years behind them. Both of those guys lack successors. Garrett will find a way to blow big games for Dallas. The Giants have win 2 Super Bowls with Eli but have generally underperformed. Philly is a mess, thanks to Chip. Its not all smooth sailing but there is a light at the end of the tunnel.

        No, he does not need to be a “franchise qb” like Brady or Peyton or Rogers. He can be successful and they can win as long as he is up to the level of a Joe Theisman with a good team around him. He has a lot of years ahead of him and the team has a GM who prefers to build via the draft and can find the right players to put around him and time is on their side.

        • Trey Gregory - Mar 31, 2016 at 2:38 AM

          @ John: you kind of said this, but kind of didn’t. I completely agree with what Redskins name said about QBs bringing longer term success than a strong defense or whatever (look over the past decade at the team’s who consistently get to the playoffs. They have one thing in common, a franchise QB.) But, they still need some pieces around them or you get Archie Manning.

          Like your Rivers example. It can’t just be a couple skilled position guys. You need, at the very least, average offensive and defensive lines. Luck is a very good QB and got murdered without a line in 2015 because Indy just loaded up on receivers and RBs. Then, you probably need at least one or two playmakers in the backfield on defense, or a crew of decent guys. But I’m not saying top 10 stuff. You just have to competently draft so you’re not spending a ton and you have young guys starting. A great QB will make those receivers and RBs look way better than they are. Just like a great Dline/pass rush will make a secondary look better.

          Then, coaching is pretty important too. Those draft picks need to develop. But the QB is that one part where the rest falls apart. If you don’t have that then you need a once in a decade type defense to really succede: and probably still an average QB. And those defenses only usually come around about… once in a decade; for one team. We’ve recently had Seattle and Denver but I think that’s going to become more and more rare with the way the league is headed.

          I still say a SB isn’t the only way to judge if a QB was successful, or good, though. Marino was obviously great. There’s at least 5 elite QBs right now and, at most, only two can make a SB. Doesn’t mean those other QBs weren’t any good.

  16. garg8050 - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:16 AM

    All depends on the definition. Statistically, in this offense, yes, its possible. Can he be one of the 5 best QBs as far as single handedly carry a team? I think that answer is no.

    I’m still hopeful that a long term deal can be completed before the season starts. If he’s playing on the tag, I could see him playing conservatively at times, looking to avoid mistakes, where a more aggressive approach may be necessary to actually win a game (i.e. down 10 with 6 minutes to go in the 4th).

    Early in the year last year, there were certainly times he opted for the checkdown instead of a shot down field. Which I totally get given how much scrutiny he was under. I’d like to see him just let it rip when the time comes and not worry about the negative play, especially when the game calls for a more aggressive approach.

    • goback2rfk - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:45 AM

      Do I trust Cousins like a top 5 QB in the playoffs and the answer is hell no. The man has very little experience as he rode the bench behind the hobbled RGKnee. This season will prove who Cousins really is and I am glad he only got the franchise. I hope they give him the 1 year deal to see what hes got.
      Sink or Swim next Season for Cousins. And I will see yall at FedEx at the Browns game next season for sure!

    • John - Mar 27, 2016 at 2:54 PM

      Without Jackson, there was no deep threat, hence no deep shots early in the season. Ross is fast but no threat. Jackson is very good at tracking the ball to get in position to catch it. Garcon is no deep threat, nor is Crowder. So yeah, early in the season he did throw short but there was a legitimate reason for that.

  17. kenlinkins - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:31 AM

    Your position on the debate is centered on your starting point. If both the Redskins and Cousins use the 2015 season as the peg in the ground we still have a wide gap. REDSKINS: if Cousins was a top 10 draft pick the Redskins could have used the 5th year option and paid Cousins about $16 million for 2016 instead of using the tag at about $20 million or allowing Cousins to hit the open market. COUSINS: The Redskins are getting a top 6 to 12 QB for an avg of about $10.5 million year (2015 / 2016) which is a heck of a deal. The CBA was set up to avoid these big jumps / gaps in pay and allow teams to keep key players longer at reduced rates but some how Cousins has landed in a bit of a CBA Hole which is rare (again, anyone want to bet that the next CBA has a way for teams to move the 5th year option to move than just first round picks?). Should Cousins have to prove more or should the Redskins just go ahead and add about $30 million to their 4 year offer? IMO the truth is in the middle in most debates with big gaps. Neither side has it totally right, but both sides are within the rules. IMO the Redskins will have a bit of a set back in the total number of wins in 2016 (maybe 7 or 8 wins) and be 2nd in the NFC East race but who will get the blame, Gruden, Cousins, the GM or maybe the defense? Is it the money or the performance that is at the center of the debate? And how much of the debate is really still about RG3 not getting on the field in 2015? I do not know for sure, but again, 2016 will be interesting to watch, the good news is that it will not be about how bad the Redskins are, as I still feel the Redskins are on the right track even if they lose a bit more in 2016, as it is the year of the adjustment/ gamble in the rebuilding process.

    • goback2rfk - Mar 27, 2016 at 11:41 AM

      There is no way Cousins can be called a top 6 – 12 QB. He is no where even in the discussion when it comes to top 12. He has only had one half of a great season. He is still raw, unproven, and should not be in the discussion of great QB’s at this point.
      You people that were comparing Cousins to Aaron Rodgers last season and even dare I say better than Aaron Rodgers you guys were smoking crack.

      • dba - Mar 27, 2016 at 2:01 PM

        Griffin thought he was as good as Rodgers. He even thought he was a good as Manning, Brady and Brees. Those guys don’t play well if their teammates don’t show up. But, receivers can only do so much with basic people.

      • bangkokben - Mar 27, 2016 at 2:51 PM

        It’s a WHOLE season. Lump ALL the good with ALL the bad and in nearly every category Cousins’ 2015 is top twelve. Now if YOU want to ONLY count ALL the good in the last half of the season, it’s top five; but who is doing that? Maybe Cousins’ agent.

      • kenlinkins - Mar 27, 2016 at 5:45 PM

        I never said he was a great QB. I was just stating both sides of the same coin. Cousins can make the claim that in 2015 he was about number 6. I know that was only for one year but look how many people still hold out hope for RG3 after he only had one year of great stats. My point was and is the old “every time I call it a game you call it a business, and every time I call it a business you call it a game” (from North Dallas Forty). Both side trying to make the best case they can for the results they want. Kind of like what you are doing?

    • Chad - Mar 27, 2016 at 3:53 PM

      If they win less that doesn’t mean they had a worse season then last year. Last year we were suppose to win 4 games by all the so called experts. This team over acheived as well as rest of division suckling. Still I give them credit. Most stat fans will scream we need to mare the playoffs again to be a good season. The rest of the football knowledgeable fans know we are still 1 or 2 years away.

      • kenlinkins - Mar 27, 2016 at 5:48 PM

        I never said they would be a worse team, in fact I think they will be a better team but lose one or two more games in 2016. Could be the schedule that gets them, poor QB play, injury, etc but IMO the roster talent will be better.

  18. Relax. - Mar 27, 2016 at 1:04 PM

    Once again, we’re ruffled over a statement taken out of context. I think Gruden is referencing that Cousins got a huge raise by getting franchise tagged, which pays him the average salary of the TOP 5 QUARTERBACKS. Gruden is saying Cousins has a lot of pressure on him to live up to the expectations that come with being paid as well as the TOP 5 QUARTERBACKS.

  19. John - Mar 27, 2016 at 1:27 PM

    RGme will fail in Cleveland. Gruden haters can think what they want but Kirk is the better fit for a pro style attack.

    RGme was signed by Cleveland in the hope that he will be able to make plays with his feet. With his slight frame and that line, I don’t see him going very far. As one person posted on yahoo it won’t be long before he’s bent into a chop stick.

    Regarding Kirk the team has consistently moved the ball down the field when he has been in there, even in 2012, 2013 and 2014. Difference was the started scoring a lot more TDs as opposed to field goals. Let’s not forget the long drives to put away opponents, not just the long comeback drives against Philly and Tampa.

    He had some bad games. The Jets game comes to mind. The Jets had one of the better defenses and the Skins had half a line and no deep threat in that game and the defense wilted in the 2nd half. People only seem to remember the 2 interceptions.

    Everyone wants to say he’s captain check down but there was no deep threat for the first half of the season. As soon as Jackson was back in the lineup, boom several 300 yd games and multiple TD passes. Not having a deep threat a poor running game will limit any QB.

    • Cpt. Obvious - Mar 27, 2016 at 3:55 PM

      Bent into a chop stick…..hate to break this to you, but chop sticks are straight.

      • John - Mar 27, 2016 at 5:47 PM

        I know that, just quoting the poster on yahoo, the other day, Captain Obvious.

  20. Mr.moneylover - Mar 27, 2016 at 1:33 PM

    If he’s not doing what he needs to do in the off-season then hell no he won’t be a top 5 QB but he show last year he can play on this level and he showed he can bounce back…I never seen so many comeback victories in one year and I never seen the redskins dominate the way they show at times last year…once they sure up the D-line and secondary this team gonna take that next step witch is winning playoff games

    • ifthethunderdontgetya™³²®© - Mar 27, 2016 at 4:12 PM

      Now this is a Redskins fan talking.

      So has it been written. So let it be done!

  21. Redskins fan no matter... - Mar 27, 2016 at 3:44 PM

    5th passer rating, 1st in comp%, 6th DVOA, 22 td and 3 int over last 10 games….all those have him a 5th overall. That’s too 5 already isn’t it?
    Maybe gruden should have said maintain his top 5 rating!!
    Sad there are people that would like to see him fail because they are rg3 fans. You really your asking your team to fail along with that? Great fans some of you are.

    • waqgman1 - Mar 27, 2016 at 6:03 PM

      Amen, Redskins fan! Agree 100%. Those who half-heartedly support Kirk Cousins and would like to see him fail will NEVER get over RGIII failing in Washington and will forever be making excuses for him. They need to go cheer for Robert in Cleveland and become Browns fans, as I suggested in an earlier response. (Lots of luck with that). Your post was spot on my friend. HTTR!!!

  22. bangkokben - Mar 27, 2016 at 3:51 PM

    As to this top 5 nonsense, Cousins’ franchise deal (a one-year deal) averages less per year than ten other QBs.
    In order:
    Joe Flacco $22.133M
    Aaron Rodgers $22M
    Russell Wilson $21,9M
    Ben Roethlisberg $21.85M
    Eli Manning $21M
    Philip Rivers $20.8125M
    Cam Newton $20.76M
    Matt Ryan $20.75M
    Tom Brady $20.5M
    Drew Brees $20M
    Kirk Cousins $19.953M

    It is also 9th in this year’s cap hits behind:
    Drew Brees $30M
    Eli Manning $24,2M
    Ben Roethlisberg $23.95M
    Matt Ryan $23.75M
    Joe Flacco $22.55M
    Matt Stafford $22.55M
    Philip Rivers $21M
    Tony Romo $20.835M

    So there are TWELVE other QBs (the first list, Stafford, and Romo) that earn more money than Cousins. (Which is why the coach didn’t do his QB any favors.) So which of these QBs is Cousins better than? Right now, probably none; perhaps Stafford. Let’s see what he can do without one of the all-time greats at making a QB look good.

    Then there are the guys on this list that are old and when it goes it goes. Peyton Manning was going into Super Bowl 48 off the best season a QB has ever had and in two years and a SB 50 victory it is clearly gone. Tom Brady will be 39 when the season starts, Drew Brees 37, and Tony Romo 36. Eli is 35, Rivers will before the season’s finished, and Big Ben is a beat up 34.

    In summary, Cousins IS NOT top 5, won’t be next year, and doesn’t have to be. He may get there in two or three years but that will depend on whether he continues to progress at his current rate, how his peers progress, and who remains in the league. But right now his salary slots him into a current tier of accomplishment. (If the market is going to throw out experience, it shouldn’t be factored into this either.)

    • Trey Gregory - Mar 28, 2016 at 1:14 PM

      Well, the franchise tag is the average of the top 5 salaries. So, it is strange that 9 other QBs would be getting more. But that’s what Gruden meant with that quote.

      • bangkokben - Mar 28, 2016 at 1:27 PM

        Yep. Thanks coach. I know what he meant and you know what he meant but that’s got to be inferred from the quote and even then the coach seems to suggest that this is what the QB needs to strive to.

        • Trey Gregory - Mar 28, 2016 at 1:52 PM

          Well, he does need to strive for it. Don’t take top 5 money if you’re not top 5. It won’t work out well. That’s why I was hoping Cousins took a long-term deal with a softer cap hit at first. You know how fans get with this stuff. A guy can have a decent season, but if fans decide he’s too expensive then things get tense.

          something I never thought about before but got from your post, the franchise tag is only the average of the top 5 players. So, there’s a chance they’re not actually making top 5 money. Never thought about that. I would have never thought it could push them down as far as 10 (obviously wasn’t a math major). But I guess with how close the big QB contracts are, it makes sense.

          And hey, I meant no offense by outlining the meaning behind that quote. Let’s be honest, it looks like most of the people who read this article didn’t get that. There’s about 5 guys who regularly post here who, I don’t always agree with, but I have faith understand what there talking about, and you’re one. I just felt the need to say that for anyone who might read after. I wanted it spelled out for them so there’s no confusion.

        • bangkokben - Mar 28, 2016 at 3:09 PM

          No offense taken. There was one poster who made that point – can’t remember who.

          Agreed that he needs to strive for it but not that it has to be made public by the coach in his 2nd year starting.

          He’s not taking top 5 money. I showed that pretty clearly and you noticed it as well. Here is the reason: “A “non-exclusive” franchise player must be offered a one-year contract for an amount no less than the average of the top five cap hits at the player’s position for the previous five years applied to the current salary cap, or 120 percent of the player’s previous year’s salary, whichever is greater.” The previous five-years is the key clause.

          What can he do but sign the tag? Is he supposed to take a lower salary than Osweiler or Bradford? That hurts the rest of the NFL players. As unfortunate as it is, the system is set up so that the guys at the top of the market taking the most possible allows the guys at the bottom more earnings. As it shrinks the Redskins cap in year one, it pushes the entire cap up later on.

    • redskinsnameisheretostay - Mar 28, 2016 at 11:00 PM

      You have good figures but you fail to account for the fact that all those QBs have many and I mean many more successful starts behind center than Cousins. In other words, these other quarterbacks have a proven sound track record. Cousins has a fraction of games started to compare yet is in the same salary range.

      What it came down to is that Cousins made some good strides at the right time just before his contract ended. This at a time when even decent quarterback play is at a premium right now in the NFL for so many teams. Cousins doesn’t have to apologize for the timing. However, he will have to deal with the pressure that comes with being a 20 million dollar QB for 2016. He’ll need to rise to that expectation and patience will wear thin now that he is garnering some serious $$$$. He’ll have some nice weapons around him next season so I think he’ll have a good supporting staff on offense if severe injuries can be avoided.

      • bangkokben - Mar 29, 2016 at 7:47 AM

        I agree that Cousins earnings this year is a perfect storm of timing – although not as perfect as Osweiler’s. The bottom line is the market is fixing itself and there is pressure to go with that contract. I just want to account for the nuance of 12th vs. 5th. Sure all those above him have more experience but if you look right below him there are guys just as close (Osweiler and Bradford).

  23. colmac69 - Mar 27, 2016 at 4:25 PM

    Can he b top 5? Tough answer because what’s your guideline/dimensions to determining his or anybody,s level?is it stats?playoff wins?superbowl rings?doing it yr after yr at high level?

    In my 30+ yrs following nfl only guys I seen that ticks my four boxes and put a team on its back is montana and brady…..Peyton manning prob a notch behind due to his playoff record which is about 50-50…other great qbs over those yrs have achieved success but imo montana/brady stand above all others

    U take guy like Marino. …as a QB he prob in top 10 all time as passer ..bundle of statistical records over maybe a 10 yr period…..few playoff wins and no rings because running game was poor and his defense was terrible…is he regarded a success prob but no rings to show for all his great play

    Before u rank cousins at upper echelons u would like to see him play at ,15 level for a few yrs….I think he can get better and push his game into top 10 over nxt couple yrs…however I also think he going to need the parts on offense to achieve this….he has proved he can move an offense and his improvement in second half of last season was there for all to see

    As fans would we like to see cousins top five or perhaps guy in top 10-12 with gd running game and great defense that can take team to playoffs and maybe a superbowl win?

    Or he maybe reached his level and his play will fall away……lots questions still but the potential is undoubtedly there….dwn to cousins to prove his worth

  24. jake - Mar 27, 2016 at 7:35 PM

    Look, it’s obvious Kirk made the team better. Jackson didn’t do much, The offensive line was in flux,and where was the run game? It was his TALENT that saved us. The only reason he’s not more respected is because he only did it once. I think the team will get better ,then we will see true greatness from Kirk as he gets more help.

  25. nomaan78 - Mar 27, 2016 at 9:21 PM

    I dont see how Cousins cannot maintain his top 5 QB status. If the Redskins build their defense it will make the team even better. I think we will solidify the D in this draft. Having Gallette, Kerrigan and Preston Smith together for a full season would make the defense much better IMO. We just need to get a few D-linemen a safety and a CB in this draft. A Center would be nice too. With the way Mcloughan is bringing in yound talent, I like our chances. A better defense with better overall talent will allow Cousins to do his thing. The more he has the ball the more points we will put up. The less the time of possession will decrease the amount of points we have to score. Cousins top 5 .

  26. greed - Mar 28, 2016 at 10:05 AM

    Did gruden really say top5 ? SMDH This guy, is it me or is he trying to relive his non existent NFL career thru Cousins

    • greed - Mar 28, 2016 at 10:50 AM

      my point Gruden shouldnt be talkin about top 5 qb or stats at this point he should be focused on kirk being consistent putting together back to back winning seasons not worrying about if he top 5 , after brady one first superbowl was the Hoody or anyone else talking about Brady being top 5 qb ? No he said he needs to improve be more consistent show this warnt a fluke season

    • Trey Gregory - Mar 28, 2016 at 1:15 PM

      Gruden said he’s getting PAID like a top 5 QB. PAID. It’s right there, not that hard to figure out.

      • greed - Mar 28, 2016 at 2:43 PM

        again doesnt matter if he getting paid like top 5 qb skins chose to pay him, doesnt mean he should play like top 5 qb was manning top 5 last yr hell no! But his team one evem when he wasnt hurt denver had a winning record yeah i know there defense was good but manning still led them, if gruden truly believe in kirk his rank ability on payscale shouldnt matter unless the gruden the skins put themselves in that position. I thought it was unwarranted pressure by gruden to bring that up

        • Trey Gregory - Mar 29, 2016 at 3:09 AM

          The point was that Gruden didn’t say Cousins was a top 5 QB. He said he’s getting paid like one. Grudent didn’t rank him, he just stated how much money he’s making.

          And that pressure comes with the money. Gruden doesn’t have to say anything. If you’re getting paid all that money, then you need to be worth it. I’m sure McCloughan would have loved to sign Cousins for $10 mil a year. If Cousins was worried about pressure, he could have done that. But he wanted what he thought was fair market value because he sees himself as a very good QB. That’s perfectly fine with me, but there’s pressure that’s built into that. Goes without being said. Gruden was just stating the obvious.

  27. murphsman - Mar 28, 2016 at 11:57 AM

    Can someone please explain to me why Brees is still considered elite when his only Super Bowl win was 7 years ago and the Saints haven’t won their division in 5 years? Brees was elite at one point, yes. But i would not consider him elite anymore. I’d put Wilson ahead of him now.

    • Trey Gregory - Mar 28, 2016 at 1:57 PM

      Because the Super Bowl isn’t the only measure of how good a QB is. Bounty Gate, aging players, and gross cap mismanagement hit that team really hard. They’re not putting a team around Drew at all. He can only do so much on his own. I don’t know how much you follow the Saints, but I pay attention to them because a few of my best friends are huge fans. They’ve been a mess the past few years. But the one constant has been good play from Drew Brees. His stats don’t always reflect that as he’s had some awful Olines lately. But if you watch him: I think he’s still elite.

      Wilson has moved up a lot though. Particularly after last year. So it doesn’t really matter to me. Both are great QBs

  28. greed - Mar 28, 2016 at 3:19 PM

    sounds like your saying gruden thinks kirk shouldve signed a deal that was worth his rank as a QB lol sorry coach that’s not how this game works ! The leauge says if you franchise tag your QB for one yr he worth 20mil

  29. mozart6023 - Mar 28, 2016 at 6:02 PM

    I don’t believe in Cousins as a viable starter, let alone a Top-5 QB. Cousins hasn’t beaten a single team with a winning record. EVER. He was simply a beneficiary of Romo and Dez Bryant injuries. The Cowboys would’ve won this division going away had they been healthy. Later this year when the Skins are back to 6-10 and miss the playoffs people won’t ever have to suffer through these ridiculous questions.

    Why are we even discussing Cousins as a Top-5 QB when there are at least 15 guys clearly better and more proven than he is? One step at a time folks.

    • Rich Tandler - Mar 28, 2016 at 6:28 PM

      This always gets me. What does Dallas having injured players have to do with Cousins’ No. 5 passer rating and No. 1 completion percentage? Where they key defenders for the Cowboys and the other defenses that Cousins faced?

      • mozart6023 - Mar 28, 2016 at 7:33 PM


        My only point is that I, and the majority of others, had Dallas as the Top team in the NFC East. Losing a Pro Bowl QB and arguably the Top WR in all of Football obviously derailed that team. The point is that with a healthy Romo/Bryant there would likely be no Division Title for the Skins. You have to admit that winning the Division is a big reason for all of the Cousins’ support and him getting the Franchise Tag. If the Skins finished 8-8 but didn’t make the playoffs you’d have to agree that the excitement would be at least somewhat diminished. Also, on to the key defenders argument. Everybody knows, when you’ve got a guy like Weeden or Cassel who isn’t moving the chains, even a stud defense will get tired eventually. I know injuries are part of the game but you have to at least realize a great offense is often a defense’s best friend. Without Romo they just didn’t have one.

        As far as the Passer Rating and Completion Percentage is concerned, one (the PR) is at least partially function of completion percentage. As my statistics professor once told me, “Stats are just ways to make the numbers look good or bad depending on what you’re trying to prove/disprove.” Not only that but let’s be honest. If there were a panel of GMs or any experts you wanted to choose that had to rank the QBs around the league I’d be shocked if Cousins cracked anyone’s Top-5 and very few, if any, would even put him in the Top-10’s. If I weren’t a Redskins fan and just happened to watch Cousins play during one of his better starts I’d likely say “That guy looks decent.” or “that guy is solid.” That’s a compliment but when you watch the truly great QBs like Rodgers, Roethlisberger, etc. they’re doing some stuff that’s pretty incredible. Stuff that I just don’t think Kirk physically will ever be able to do. It’s not all just physical limitations though. Versus GB he looked like he resorted back to form once pressure started getting through. I’d have to watch the game again but I remember at least 2 or 3 passes that should’ve been intercepted. One was so bad the only reason it wasn’t picked is because two defenders knocked each other down. He looked lost at times.

        Cousins may prove me wrong and get a lot better but I’m just not seeing it. Someone mentioned Dilfer. Sure he can do that. If Scot is going to build that caliber of defense then Cousins will be just fine.

        • John - Mar 28, 2016 at 10:34 PM

          The Green Bay game.e was his first playoff game. You may not want to admit it but much of the teams success was due to Kirk. He had a piss poor running game behind him and a pretty Shakey defense on the other side of the ball. While Kirk did not have his best game against the Packers, the Packers to much for the Skins this time around.

          Regarding the Cowboys and Romo being front runners, I don’t doubt your point, however not having a running game (Murray) and throwing it 50 times a game when its not their best gambit, certainly puts Romo in a position to blow games. Romo is getting banged up more as the years pass and at present don’t have an heir apparent.

          For the Skins to win, they need to build up their talent. Right now they have receivers, a QB and a so, so offensive line. The defense has some pieces but also alot of holes. The special teams have been suspect for a while now. You can’t go into the playoffs without a running game and expect to go very far and at some point, you have to be ale to stop the other team. A QB alone can take a team only so far without a supporting cast.

        • - Mar 29, 2016 at 12:38 AM

          I would have the exact same feeling that I have about Cousins now, if he played the same way, but we missed the playoffs. The playoffs are completely irrelevant to me. Because I knew the entire team wasn’t ready for that. Doesn’t mean Cousins wouldn’t have had an amazing season. Sometimes QBs have great seasons and don’t make the playoffs. It happens all the time.

          Your professor was right, but I suspect he was talking about political polls. That line of thinking doesn’t apply to passer ratings because each QB is tested to the same formula. It’s a level playing field here. If Washington had their own way of devising QBR and Dallas had their own, then yeah, it would be shady. But we take their numbers and put test them under the same standards. Of all the starting QBs who were tested like that, Cousins ranked in the top 5. That’s the difference between someone bending stats to look like something and stats being a useful tool.

    • Skulb - Mar 28, 2016 at 9:27 PM

      We’re discussing actual stats from the actual season these players actually played last year; not some subjective preconceived ranking in our own little minds. He WAS a top five QB and then some for the back half of the season. Simple as. If you want to busy yourself explaining away this fact then knock yourself out. I imagine you would have reacted differently if it was a QB you liked who performed like this. For example: Cousins did perform at an elite level for more consecutive games in 2015 than Griffin did in 2012, and he wasn’t seriously injured in the process. Did you nitpick Robert like this in 2012? Or were you in fact sold on him as a franchise QB and unable to change your mind on the issue as his performances devolved into incompetence?
      I know what is going on here. People decided long ago based on a microscopic sample size and their infatuation with Griffin that Cousins was a “career backup” and “interception machine” and “untalented”. And now they are unable or unwilling to revise their opinion after both QBs have proved them utterly wrong. Instead they flail around for some way to rationalize reality in a way that confirms their erroneous, and now quite ancient, preconceptions. Anyone who actually watched the Redskins play last season knows that the only conversation about Cousins that matters, short of his contract, is whether or not he can sustain the top 5 level of play he reached last year. I am almost convinced that he will.

      As for beating winning teams they had exactly three shots at this, all of them on the road. The Pats, the Panthers and the Jets, the last team seriously hot at the time. Most teams in the NFL would lose those away games 9 out of ten tries because it basically doesn’t get any harder. By comparison the Patriots ( I hope you will accept them as a legitimate team here, but who knows?) played only four RS games against winning teams. Twice against the Jets, once against the Broncos and once against the Steelers. And surprise surprise they won both their home games (of which the Skins had none against winning teams) and lost both away games. Give Cousins and the Skins Pittsburgh or New York at home and they would probably have won it. It’s a statistical fluke and a non-argument. But keep repeating it by all means. It beats admitting that you’ve been wrong I suppose.

      • Skulb - Mar 28, 2016 at 11:59 PM

        Just a slight correction: the Pats did play the Redskins who were a winning team. I am still having some trouble getting used to it.

      • Trey Gregory - Mar 29, 2016 at 3:04 AM

        You nailed it Skulb: people made their decision about who Clusins was based off an extremely small sample size AND from when he was in a less than ideal circumstance (no offseason as starter, first team reps, offense not tailored to him, no timing with receivers. Oh, and the 2013-2014 teams were awful. Just plain awful). So, based on that, we can ignore all the great stuff he did in 2015.

        I fully expect him to come down to earth a bit next year. But I think this guy can be a very good QB for us consistently.

        The never beating a winning team thing drives me nuts. THAT actually is an example of cherry picking stats. For the reasons you pointed out. He hasn’t had a lot of opportunities, and hey we’re on the road. Plus, look at those teams. Those teams, combined, only lost a handful of games the whole season and that includes against teams with good QBs. Washington, as a whole, is no where even near where Carolina and NE are as a team right now. That’s not all on Cousins. Those were team losses. People also forget the number of injuries we were dealing with before the Jets game. I want to say it was double digit pre season starters were out. We had third stringers out there. And the game didn’t get out of control. That’s a positive. Greenbay lost to Carolina too. Guess that means Aaron Rogers sucks! Because there’s no way a good QB can lose a game if the team around him isn’t at the level of the opposing team.

        I’ve said it before but maybe it needs repeating. Cousins never threw more TDs than interceptions, until he did. He never won on the road, until he did. He never won back to back games, until he did. He never lead a huge comeback for a win, until he did. There’s more but I’m tired and can’t think. These were all things people said about him last year, until they couldn’t anymore. This “never beat a team with a winning record” BS is the last thing these guys have. No matter how misleading it is. But he will overcome this too. Just not by himself. Because, as much as people try to make it, wins and losses are not a QB stat: they’re a team stat. QBs throw interceptions, teams win or lose. Keep building a good team around Cousins and good things will happen.

        • Skulb - Mar 29, 2016 at 7:39 AM

          Precisely Trey. Brady lost both his away games against winning teams so therefore he sucks too and how dare him even pretend to be a football player!? It’s just so banal and stupid you hardly know where to begin sometimes. I agree with everything you wrote, but particularly the last paragraph. What Skins fans saw as milestones for him and the developing team to overcome the Mad Evangelists of Cousins Doom and Gloom chose to see as evidence that he wasn’t good enough. Interception machine, can’t win big, can’t win away, can’t win consecutive, can’t win the division, can’t beat winning teams and can’t win a playoff game.\

          We’re down to the last two non-arguments now. I’ll be cheering for him to reach both targets in 16. And even if he doesn’t and takes a step back I’ll be cheering anyway. I suppose the naysayers will then start whining about how he can’t win a Superbowl so maybe he’d just better get that one out of the way in 16 too.

        • Skulb - Mar 29, 2016 at 7:54 AM

          Oh and yes it’s the team. That’s why I am confident Cousins will sustain his form. Not only will he personally be more prepared but the team will be more tailored to the system than it was last year. Unless they all suddenly develop stage fright from the increased expectations I am fully expecting further strides to be made by all involved. As a seasoned Redskins pessimist I am astounding myself by already expecting another divisional title and the second playoff win of the millennium.

          I will change this expectation if and only if:

          1: Gruden gets fired or dies.
          2: McCloughan gets fired or dies.
          3: Kirk Cousins gets fired or joins a cult.

  30. mozart6023 - Mar 29, 2016 at 4:00 AM

    C’mon guys. Nobody on this planet or even in this solar system regards Cousins as a Top 5 QB. They just don’t. He was tops in Completion Percentage and 5th in Passer Rating. Great. Was he the MVP? A Pro Bowler? All-Pro? Did he win the Super Bowl? A playoff game? Once again he hasn’t even won a game against a winning team. What was his signature moment? A rally against a hapless Tampa Bay team that basically gave the game away by committing god awful penalties and then screaming “You Like That!” The only way you earn a Top-5 ranking at QB is by winning playoff games. Until you do that you just aren’t going to be considered an elite QB, heck you aren’t even going to be considered Top-10 without playoff success. The few exceptions are juggernauts like Fouts and Marino. Kirk isn’t going to be confused with either Dan anytime soon.

    As for my assessment of Cousins, I had always said he was a top level backup or a low grade starter. He was a 4th round pick and had shown enough to get Shanahan excited about his future. Even though Mike also thought John Beck was a great prospect, I still think he knows more about QBs than myself so I was happy to have Cousins as a backup. His first extended stint as a starter was obviously pretty rough although he had some decent performances that just fell short of victories like the game against Atlanta. This year was a mixed bag but he did step his game up down the stretch and I have to give him credit for that. The second half of the playoff game was a disaster though. He looked like he did early in the season. I think ultimately, Kirk can be really successful with Gruden but I just see him as a Matt Hasselbeck type. Hasselbeck was a steady, good but not great QB. Nothing wrong with that. Around here if you don’t think he’s the next Joe Montana you’re labeled a hater. I don’t get it.

    Lastly, I’ll cover the stats aspect of the debate.

    Passer rating is dependent on completion percentage. When you throw heavy doses of short passes 2 things should happen: 1) Your completion percentage should go up and 2) Your interceptions should go down. Both completion percentage and Interceptions are factors in determining the Passer Rating, therefore Cousins benefited from Gruden’s conservative attack.

    Now on to the running game. The running game was awful. I agree. However, at least part of that has to be attributed to the dink-n-dunk offense. When defenses know that your tendency is to throw a bunch of short screens and slants they will obviously have more bodies around the line of scrimmage than if you are consistently and successfully going vertical. It’s common sense.

    Finally, I believe Cousins is a good fit for Gruden’s system. If Scot M can put together a talented roster there is a chance Kirk can be a long term winner. I just don’t think he’s ever going to be a Top-5, future HOF QB. Once again, it’s been proven you don’t have to be a great QB to win a SB. Guys like Jeff Hostetler and Trent Dilfer won SBs. Also, a quick note about Griffin since you brought him up. Griffin failed here due to 1) Knee Injury, 2) His desire to immediately become a pocket passer after the knee injury, 3) Snyder interfering with the player-coach dynamic. I think if Robert would’ve just stayed the course with the Shanahans and just added a little of the pocket skills to his game every year he would’ve been much better off. Even Mike said it would take about 5 years to master the system. It obviously didn’t happen so let’s move on.

  31. mozart6023 - Mar 29, 2016 at 4:24 AM

    Wanted to add that NO ONE is saying Kirk will never beat a team with a winning record just that he hasn’t yet and that is a fact. Whether or not you consider it “Cherry Picking” doesn’t make it any less true. The reason it is absolutely critical is that in order to win a Super Bowl, most often you are going to have to beat 4 winning teams in a row. When you haven’t even beaten one it seems like a stretch to think you’ll beat 4 in a row. Maybe he eventually gets there, who knows but pretending last year Kirk turned in some kind of epic, storybook performance to win the worst division in football is laughable.

    There are many people on here and CSN who continually refer to 2012 as a fluke and Robert as a gimmick. Call it what you like but any team winning a division without a single victory against a team above .500 is every bit of a fluke. I don’t have the time to do the research but I’ll bet you can count those teams on one hand.

  32. pyroman99 - Mar 31, 2016 at 1:43 AM

    I just want to point out something to all of you folks who are harping on “Cousins didn’t beat a team with a winning record”. Think for a minute how dumb that sounds….

    OK, consider this: One reason some of those teams didn’t finish with a winning record is because THE SKINS BEAT THEM!!

    Buffalo finished 8 – 8. Take away their loss to the Skins and they were 8 – 7. i.e. they would have been over .500. Except, they played the Skins, with Cousins at QB, and LOST. So, you want to hold the Skins’ winning performance against Cousins??

    BTW, the Eagles’ record of 7 – 9 included 2 losses to the Skins. Take those away, and it leaves the Eagles at 7 – 7, or .500.

    Let’s take it a step further. If the Bills won, and were credited with that win, they would have ended 9 – 7. If the Eagle had won both games, they’re a 9 – 7 team. (BTW, if the Skins had lost to the Rams and Saints, who both finished 7 – 9, they would have lost to teams with final 8 – 8 records.)

    What totally amazes me is that I’ve seen probably hundreds of posts, many of them actually favorable to Cousins, that unthinkingly repeat the same BS “Cousins didn’t beat a winning team” without thinking it through. So I’ll repeat the simple fact: the Skins beat at least one team that would have been a winning team if the Skins hadn’t beaten them. And, if instead of simply removing the Skins’ wins from the records of other teams, and instead credit those teams with wins over the Skins, they beat 2 teams that WOULD have finished 9 – 7, and two other that would have finished 8 – 8.

    Everyone have a nice night.

    • Trey Gregory - Mar 31, 2016 at 9:45 AM

      Not a bad point. I’ve made a ton of arguments for why saying Cousins never beat a winning team is ridiculous. But I never thought of this one.

      Another thing is, like you said, they beat 8-8 teams. Not winning records but not losing records either.

    • mozart6023 - Apr 1, 2016 at 4:51 PM

      You guys are reading too much into the winning record stat. It still is simply a statistic but the larger point is that he’s never beaten a GOOD TEAM, A TRUE PLAYOFF CALIBER TEAM. Eventually he’ll beat a 9-7 team. Great. You’ve got to beat 14-2 teams, 13-3 teams, 12-4 teams to go anywhere. Not many teams are winning super bowls without going through those good teams.

      Quit getting upset about claims of not beating a winning team. CAN HE BEAT THE GOOD AND GREAT TEAMS? That’s how you are measured. Instead of arguing the possibility of the Bills finishing 9-7 if the Skins had lost to them, ask yourself if the Bills were a good team or a pretender? If your being honest they were a middle-of-the-pack pretender. Ask yourself about the Eagles. Were they a good team? Hell No.

      If you’re all upset about people saying Kirk hasn’t beaten a winning team then bring up the list of good teams he’s beaten. It’s still ZERO. The friggin’ Jets didn’t even make the playoffs and they beat the Skins like a drum. What Super Bowl Contender, Legitimate Playoff Team has this guy ever even come close to beating? NOT ONE.

      • Trey Gregory - Apr 1, 2016 at 6:45 PM

        @mazart: do me a favor. Go look at the injury list for the Jets game. Look at all the players who were out for that game or limited. It was huge.

        It’s mind blowing that I have to say this, but football is a team sport. Kirk Cousins hasn’t beaten or lost to any team: the Washington Redskins have. Those 14-2 teams, they usually have pretty damn good rosters from top to bottom. Washington hasn’t had that since Cousins arrived. In fact, Washington has had a couple god awful teams since Cousins arrived. So relax. How did Aaron Rogers do last year without a better team around him? Andrew Luck? Matt Ryan? Phillip Rivers? Joe Flacco? Eli Manning? Then again, how did Alex Smith do with a great team? Andy Dalton? Peyton Manning won a Super Bowl playing, statistically, as the worst starting QB in the league. Has Russell Wilsom ever had a bad team around him? But we’re cool calling him a great QB (which he is) but can’t even say Cousins in good based off a TEAM record. Really?

        If you really want to evaluate Cousins, and not just fit your agenda then you should compare his stats against good defenses vs bad defenses. You might me surprised.

        There’s also zero reason to believe Cousins has reached his ceiling and can’t continue to improve. I wouldn’t be 100% happy with Cousins if I thought this was as good as he gets. But I can see the potential and believe he will continue to develop. I also believe he is good enough to beat good/great teams as the team around him improves.

        Then, say you’re right and this is as good as he gets. It’s been decades since Washington has had stability at QB. Cousins, as he is now, is plenty good enough to bring stability through a rebuild while we look for/groom the QB of the future. Washington doesn’t have to be the laughing stock of the league, can actually win some games, attract coaching/FA talent, and create a better culture far easier with a stable QB presence instead of what it has been like for years.

        My point is that there’s just no reason to be down on Cousins. His presence is good for the team one way or the other. 2015 was year one of a rebuild. They weren’t supposed to beat 14-2 teams. That’s not how it works. Get over it already

        • mozart6023 - Apr 2, 2016 at 11:59 PM

          You Cousins bandwagon riders need to relax. Rich’s article asked if Cousins can be a Top-5 QB. Of course I’ll agree it’s a team sport and that 14-2 teams are good top to bottom but once again the question was can Kirk be a Top-5 QB? Top Completion Percentage and Top 5 Passer Rating are nice stats but don’t mean much when assigning ranks to QB. Now if he leads in Yds and TDs with the good comp pct and passer rating then that is a different story. This isn’t a 100M dash where if you come in 5th you get to say you were the 5th fastest. Everybody knows damn well you’ve got to win playoff games and a SB to even enter the discussion for a Top-5 QB. Had Kirk lit it up against GB even I would have to admit he has the potential to reach that level. Instead, like he always has against good teams, he absolutely shrunk in the 2nd half.

          The other argument is that when your team is stacked on defense like the Broncos and Ravens you’ve got to do more than manage the game to earn Top-5. Peyton won a SB but nobody would dare say he was Top-5 last year. Flacco won a SB and a ton of playoff games but he’s never even considered as Top-5. Eli has Two SBs and has put up some decent statistics and is barely even mentioned as Top-5. Really, the only chance Kirk will ever be even mentioned in the discussion is by taking the team on a deep playoff run and winning a SB. I’m saying he doesn’t have what it takes, you disagree. That’s fine. Just remember the question was can he be a Top-5 QB. Top-5 pretty much Brady, Rodgers, Big Ben, Brees, and then you can argue for Wilson, Eli, Flacco, whomever. As of right now I can only see a handful of teams he would be starting for and a handful of others with young QBs you can argue whether Cousins would rate higher than. If they had a power ranking of QBs Cousins is in the bottom half of the league and likely bottom 10. He’s going to have to show A LOT to be mentioned in the Top-10 let alone Top-5. That was the question. Will he challenge Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Big Ben? I’m doubting it but hey you guys are free to dream. Archives

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